. >> rose: science exploration. >> rose: and we spent about 30% on transfer payments to the elderly. >> we now spend 68% on transfer payments but investments are down to 15%. so i think to larry's point, what did we get out of the investment? well, we got the internet. we got g.p.s., we got the human genome. >> rose: so that's where you agree with him. >> i totally agree. and if you look at the sequester -- >> rose: that the investments are worthwhile and important and crucial to our future. >> yes, but we are cutting the investments so we can continue to let transfer payments to the elderly grow at a very rapid rate. we cannot do both. >> rose: or we're cutting the investments because we do not have a realistic look at where taxes-- which you're prepared to have a real itselfic look at. yes? in other words, you're not coming here as a representative a view often expressed by the 30 members of congress, although you had reservations about the health fund, defunding the health care even though you expressed riz reservations about it. my point is you did not -- you thought they were si